Media coverage of the integration of the CCG into DND seems more focused on the ships - there seems to be little to no coverage of the CCG air service. No mention in official releases either.
A lot is still up in the air. The fact is that theres a lot not settled, or still just discussions. Its gonna be a long, tough process of figuring it all out sadly.
I believe we're at 72? at least on the books. I don't think thats changed. However that isnt speaking to the obvious condition of the fleet, especially the A4.
We had 82 Gun Leopards and 18 Armoured engineering variants and 12 Armoured recovery variants before our donations to Ukraine.
Specifically we had 42 Leo 2A4, 20 Leo 2A4M and 20 Leo 2A6M. Canada donated 8 2A4’s and 1 Armoured recovery variant.
We now have 34 Leo 2A4’s,20 2A4M’s and the 20 2A6’s. 18 Armoured Engineering vehicles and 11 Armoured Recovery so the total is 103 vehicles. Too friggin few and yes I am a geek.
Well that matches up with 103 upgrades. Too bad I was really hoping for an increase in numbers especially the gunned versions considering around 45 are used for training. With anywhere between 12 and 20 deployed in Latvia etc.. that only leaves between 2 and 10 gunned tanks for self defense assuming they're not all in maintenance. Wow that sounds sad and ridiculous. I'm ashamed of our Government.
For Canada, tanks are useful for contributing some firepower to an overseas mission, and that's about it. For that, 103 are sufficient, assuming they're well-maintained. I can't see any useful role for them in the defence of Canada.
I disagree entirely. That would be under the assumption that Canada will never be invaded and therefore doesn't need deturance or defense capabilities nor the capacity to send tanks into future NATO related conflicts. In this changing World dynamics that assumption is no longer a safe bet. When a single amphibious ship can drop off 40 tanks in one shot the defending Country having 0 to 10 tanks to counter has no deturance or defence should that ship be capable of delivering. It also makes any armored brigade that may be called upon from Canada in any future conflict virtually toothless in that area.
More geekdom, Canadian Armoured peacetime history gives our Regiments three 19 Tank Squadrons plus an 8 vehicle Recce troop per Regiment. Canada has not had that well resourced a unit since Afghanistan.TechnIcally we should have THREE fully resourced Regiments. The Army
Is playing with doctrine and history by introducing “ Cavalry”
Into the modern discussion of what to do with the RCAC.
Personally it’s time to commit to three exactly organized regiments of 2 Leo 2A7 squadrons of 19 Tanks each with a single 19 vehicle CV-9030 squadron. Combined NATO arms . Period.
My opinion is we should have twice as many to be able to deploy, train and maintain a sizeable force for self defense. Hopefully that number is for gunned version only and does not include engineering and recovery versions as that would not be much of an increase at all. Guess we'll have to wait and see.
As I recall (somewhat hazy) When they were flying DC-3 on pollution patrol, that the aircraft and pilots were CCG owned, I could be wrong on this though. The DC-3 I think was retired 1989/90? The reason they grouped all the aircraft under TC Civil aviation is it gave you a pool of pilots/maintainers to fly/maintain Kingairs, helicopters (206, 212) floatplanes, and the Dash 8's. If they cleave off only that portion they may shrink the pool of available pilots?
Media coverage of the integration of the CCG into DND seems more focused on the ships - there seems to be little to no coverage of the CCG air service. No mention in official releases either.
A lot is still up in the air. The fact is that theres a lot not settled, or still just discussions. Its gonna be a long, tough process of figuring it all out sadly.
What’s our actual fleet size of our Leo 2s I thought it was around 80 (frontline not including the armour school)
I believe we're at 72? at least on the books. I don't think thats changed. However that isnt speaking to the obvious condition of the fleet, especially the A4.
So I guess we’re getting more then?
As far as I know that would be part of the plan here.
We had 82 Gun Leopards and 18 Armoured engineering variants and 12 Armoured recovery variants before our donations to Ukraine.
Specifically we had 42 Leo 2A4, 20 Leo 2A4M and 20 Leo 2A6M. Canada donated 8 2A4’s and 1 Armoured recovery variant.
We now have 34 Leo 2A4’s,20 2A4M’s and the 20 2A6’s. 18 Armoured Engineering vehicles and 11 Armoured Recovery so the total is 103 vehicles. Too friggin few and yes I am a geek.
Well that matches up with 103 upgrades. Too bad I was really hoping for an increase in numbers especially the gunned versions considering around 45 are used for training. With anywhere between 12 and 20 deployed in Latvia etc.. that only leaves between 2 and 10 gunned tanks for self defense assuming they're not all in maintenance. Wow that sounds sad and ridiculous. I'm ashamed of our Government.
For Canada, tanks are useful for contributing some firepower to an overseas mission, and that's about it. For that, 103 are sufficient, assuming they're well-maintained. I can't see any useful role for them in the defence of Canada.
I disagree entirely. That would be under the assumption that Canada will never be invaded and therefore doesn't need deturance or defense capabilities nor the capacity to send tanks into future NATO related conflicts. In this changing World dynamics that assumption is no longer a safe bet. When a single amphibious ship can drop off 40 tanks in one shot the defending Country having 0 to 10 tanks to counter has no deturance or defence should that ship be capable of delivering. It also makes any armored brigade that may be called upon from Canada in any future conflict virtually toothless in that area.
Total in inventory is 72, including the school. Only the Strats currently field them on their official TO&E, so I guess ~44 tanks at a frontline unit
More geekdom, Canadian Armoured peacetime history gives our Regiments three 19 Tank Squadrons plus an 8 vehicle Recce troop per Regiment. Canada has not had that well resourced a unit since Afghanistan.TechnIcally we should have THREE fully resourced Regiments. The Army
Is playing with doctrine and history by introducing “ Cavalry”
Into the modern discussion of what to do with the RCAC.
Personally it’s time to commit to three exactly organized regiments of 2 Leo 2A7 squadrons of 19 Tanks each with a single 19 vehicle CV-9030 squadron. Combined NATO arms . Period.
My opinion is we should have twice as many to be able to deploy, train and maintain a sizeable force for self defense. Hopefully that number is for gunned version only and does not include engineering and recovery versions as that would not be much of an increase at all. Guess we'll have to wait and see.
As I recall (somewhat hazy) When they were flying DC-3 on pollution patrol, that the aircraft and pilots were CCG owned, I could be wrong on this though. The DC-3 I think was retired 1989/90? The reason they grouped all the aircraft under TC Civil aviation is it gave you a pool of pilots/maintainers to fly/maintain Kingairs, helicopters (206, 212) floatplanes, and the Dash 8's. If they cleave off only that portion they may shrink the pool of available pilots?